INTERVIEW WITH TERRY ANDERSON, 1998
Originally Australian, Terry Anderson won seventeen US National Pistol Titles in Rapid Fire, Standard Pistol, and Center Fire. He has also been involved in coaching programs all over the world for more than thirty years.
When did you start shooting?
The first match I went to was in 1967. I went to the Olympic trials in 1968, which was in Melbourne. It was the old ’56 Olympic range.
What was your first club?
St Ives Pistol Club in Sydney.
1967 – that was before air pistol and standard were introduced?
That’s right. Standard was brought in for the 1970 World Championships. We shot Standard Pistol, my brother was state champion (New South Wales) I think in ’68, 69 and I was State Champion ’70 through ’73.
So you shot in Australia until.
1973, when I moved to the States.
Now, after Rapid Fire this year, how many National titles do you have here?
Seventeen.
Have you ever had a full time coach?
No.
Self coached all the way?
Yes, pretty well. I was picked up here as a coach for one of the reserve teams. In 1974 I was in Brazil and trained their team. Actually I helped them develop their whole program, what I designed in ’74 is still in place today. In 1976 I coached the Israeli Olympic Team, I spent about four or five weeks over there. They only had two Olympians. They came over here and shot the National Championships and I helped prepare them, then I sent them down to Benning where Krilling worked with them. I went back to Israel a bunch of times. By 1979 they had a really good consolidated program designed on a junior program. In 1979 they made me the National Coach for the US. I did it conditional, at that stage I was National Champion as well, I told them I’d take the position as long as I could try out for the Olympic Team as an individual, which they agreed to. So I was the only competing National Coach. In 1980 I made the Olympic Team and then stepped down for a couple of years.
The Olympic Team in 1980 didn’t go, have you shot in an Olympics?
No. I was on in 1980 and 1996 (as an alternate).
Over the years who would you say has been your greatest shooting influence?
I’d say my brother. He had developed some pretty revolutionary programs back in the late sixties. We’d gone very much in depth how to prepare grips, mental training, we developed an extremely strong mental training program. By the time I came over here and stayed at the Marksmanship Unit I found that a lot of the programs I was using that the rifle team at Benning were using, but the pistol team were not. I stepped straight in and the rifle program in those days was Wigger, Ryder and Bassham, and they were using the same thing as I was, which was a very strong mental training program. Visualization, etc, etc, etc, and I imparted that knowledge in a number of countries I trained. Mainly Brazil and Israel. In fact the Israelis were quite surprised at the program I put on for them in ’76, because most of the stuff we were doing then which was revolutionary is now standard in the sport.
Rapid Fire being your main event, what brand of pistol do you shoot and have you always used it?
I used to have an FAS, and in 1983 I was Pan American Champion and record holder. I went into the Olympic trials in 1984 unbeaten and unbeatable as far as I was concerned. I had a slide break on my FAS and I ended up on the first day in 23rd place. On the next two days I shot 593 and 594, I went into third place. It cost me the Olympic Team slot in 1984. And they were the days when I was shooting really world class scores. So I said that’s it. I picked up a Walther. They had listened to some advice I was putting in on developing the new Rapid Fire gun, which they called the Match, so I got serial number one and two of the new model. In fact they were a gift from Walther to me, I still have them. One of them I’ve got the 2000 slide on, but they’re basically the same guns.
So you’re still shooting them now?
Yes. And they gave me the upgrade slide, so I’ve got the 2000, which is just really an extended rear sight and some very mild modifications to the bolt.
Just a couple of technical questions for Rapid Fire. Which target do you line up on?
Always the first.
Because there are differing schools of thought about it.
Not at world level. I think you’ll find the different schools below the world level shooters. The first target is the most important target. Then the transition to the second target from vertical to horizontal is very important, and the other three just fall into place. But you always line up on the first target. If you’re not, if you line up on the last target, how can you transition? In fact I’ll give you a good example. When I was down in Brazil in 1974 I turned up, I was 29 years old, their new national coach. I wasn’t getting very far. They weren’t going to listen to me. So I figured I’ll try and show these guys what shooting’s all about, either that or I’m going to leave. I’d been there maybe eight or nine days at the time. I put all of them out in front of me on the firing line, with a gap so I could see the target. I put one round in the gun and told them to watch my eyes. I lined up on the first target, came down to 45 degrees, closed my eyes, came up and fired the shot. I told them I don’t know whether the targets were regulation height. They look like they are but they may not be, and the regulation was a six inch variation approximately. So that shot will be between a high eight and a low eight. It was a ten. I said, “Look fellas, if I can shoot a ten with my eyes shut, I’ve got to be able to teach you guys to shoot tens with your eyes open”. From that moment forward I never had one question from the Brazilians about how to shoot. The whole point is, if everything’s right you can swing that gun up from 45 degrees to center and fire a shot, you confirm the sights are lined up, but everything should be so that gun will stop in the middle of the ten ring, and all you’re really doing is quickly confirming that the sights are lined up and firing the shot. It’s automatic. As soon as that gun settles it goes off, and it will be a ten.
What do you consider to be the most important training drill for Rapid?
You need to be able to shoot tens first. Then worry about the timing. It’s no use trying to train people how to shoot four seconds if they can’t shoot tens. So we go through the drill of training first shot ten, first shot ten, first and second shot tens, first and second shot tens – this was the old Romanian training system. And then you move from first, second, third, fourth and fifth shot, then we worry about turning the targets or putting a timer in place. But make sure you learn how to shoot tens. Air pistol is phenomenal training for Rapid Fire because it trains you how to line everything up and keep that gun stable.
Do you think that there was a big difference when they changed from turning targets to electronic targets?
Not really. There shouldn’t be.
It didn’t affect you at all?
No. I always had extremely good motion perception, so when the targets started to turn I had a good relationship with them. There was no difference between that and the lights coming on. Except when they first came out they didn’t make the lights bright enough, so if you had a lot of sunlight you really had trouble picking it up. Now they’ve got a light intensity regulation so that you can tell.
What have you found to be the most reliable and accurate ammunition?
Select lots. You’ve got to have select lots. In Rapid Fire the ammunition can vary between two inch groups and half inch groups, and you’ll get that within various manufacturers’ runs. So it’s critical to test the gun to the ammunition. I don’t think a lot of people do that and I think that’s one of the reasons there is such a shallow top group of shooters in Rapid Fire. I know I’ve put ammunition through my gun that won’t quite hold the ten ring. How the hell can you shoot a 300 if your gun’s not capable of shooting tens? I mean the ten ring’s pretty big. But over the years R25 has been consistent, Fiocchi’s improved their quality. Eley has now improved their quality. I went over to Eley about five years ago and worked on upgrading their ammunition. I haven’t had a chance to check their quality any more but we got the quality of the Rapid Fire Shorts so that it was very consistent. It has a bit more recoil due to the priming mix, they use more priming mix than anyone else, probably twice as much priming mix as R25, so the initial recoil is caused by that. Really R25 and Fiocchi are excellent, the new Eley, which is the purple box, is great. Probably accuracy-wise, Eley would be more consistently accurate than the others, you don’t get as much variation. I’ve had R25 lots that will group an inch and a half, while even the worst Eley lot won’t get that bad. So the Eley shorts are probably more consistent. There’s a bit more recoil but you can fix that by opening more holes up (barrel ports).
For a competition like this, how have you prepared?
It tends to be during the off season I go down the range and just go through technique, and the technique is shooting tens. It may be just faced targets, maybe speeding up a bit, but not necessarily staying within the four seconds zone. In other words learning how to shoot tens. Before a match, some six or eight weeks out, start pushing the times, so you’re staying within the eight, six and four seconds. In four seconds it’s obviously critical to get that first shot to break in under one point five seconds. And the most important thing is the last shot’s got to break in under three point nine. I remember asking Corneliu (from Romania, was a very close friend of mine back in the late 70s early 80s, he still is today, he’s their national coach there now). I asked him, what’s the most important thing in four seconds. He said to get the last shot off in three point nine seconds.
They do have some allowance, of point two of a second?
Yes, but your bullet down range time is point one two, so you need to break that last shot in under four seconds. In the old days the turning targets were always calibrated to turn in four seconds to four point two seconds. I found a lot of ranges calibrated four point zero one to four point zero two. I had a late shot in 1988 in Moscow, and those targets were phenomenally fast. It cost me an Olympic Team slot, I made the Olympic Team in 88 but had no MQS. I was only sent to one World Cup to MQS, and I was shooting beside Corneliu on the range. I ended up having a miss, and I was two points off an MQS. In those days the MQS was pretty tough. I actually left them a skid shot. It took them five or six minutes to deliberate, and the jury member came back and said, “We don’t many times get skids on these targets, they’re either there or not.” So I actually fired before the targets started to turn and it caught the target and left a keyhole. It was just slightly wider than the requirements, which I think was 7mm, one and a half diameters of the bullet.
In leading up to something like this how often would you train each week?
Going into brackets, usually take off in the winter to clear the cobwebs, and then start training usually by February it’s warm enough to be able to train, so I’d get down to the range and start. Open the diary, look through the program that had worked very effectively the year before, or the year before that, whichever the best program was, and sometimes it wasn’t last year’s program. Renew that program, get it up again, usually it might be a weekend, and when we get close to a tryout, whatever it may be, bring it up to five days a week. This particular program I started unfortunately was after the first Olympic tryout. So in the beginning of May I started basically between four and five days – we had a lot of rain, so there were days I couldn’t shoot – so four to five days a week from then to now. That’s about a six week program.
Rapid Fire is very intense, as in a lot happens in a small space of time. How do you handle the mental game to make sure you’re switched on when you have to be?
That’s part of the preparation. Going through and visualizing, knowing what it’s going to take and setting up a very concise plan, which is obviously watching the front sight. Recalling a perfect series where the gun comes up, settles in the middle of the target, the shot breaks, goes to the second target, and so forth. So visualizing that and just as the countdown goes put the gun in the middle of the target, pick up that front sight, bring it down at the count of “one” and then visualize that gun coming up and settling in the middle of the target, so that when the lights go on all you’re doing is going through that cycle. The gun settles in the middle of the target, goes off, to the second, goes off, and so forth. In each case watching the front sight. The difference between eight and four seconds, you’re doing exactly the same thing, but just speeding up the timing.
What was your funniest shooting experience?
I think the look on the Brazilians’ faces when I shot a ten with my eyes shut. Oh, I did have one up in Canada where I trained the Canadian Pentathlon Team in 1976. I had never shot Pentathlon so I turned up with the Pentathletes and I said, “What’s the course of fire?” They looked at me rather strangely, here I was to be their coach for four weeks. They said it’s the same as center fire (duel sequence with a Rapid Fire pistol), it’s three and seven, three and seven (in series of five shots). I said, “This is interesting. What’s your National Record?” They said it’s 186 out of 200. I said, “Can I have a go?” So I stepped up to the line, loaded two magazines, told the block officer to turn the target away. The targets faced for three seconds and I came up and fired three shots, in three seconds, just blat-blat-blat. The next time they turned I came up, and went blat-blat. Then I dropped the magazine out, put a new one in within the seven seconds delay, the targets came around, I swung back up, three shots, and then two shots. So in four exposures of the target I had fired ten shots. So as the fifth exposure came around I was loading my magazines again. The guy behind me said, “Hang on, that’s not how you do it; it’s only ONE shot in three seconds, not three shots”, and I said, “well, this looks okay, let me try it again.” So I did exactly the same thing. We walked out and I had a 199 out of 200, and I said, “Your national record is what?” The guys looked kind of sheepish at me and I said, “Look, I’ll tell you what. I’ve never shot this before like that. I’ll bet you twenty dollars I can shoot 200 out of 200 on that target”, because the nine that I had was almost a plug shot, it was probably a sixteenth of an inch off the line. I didn’t have any takers on the twenty dollar offer. When I left four weeks later their national record was 194. So mentally they had convinced themselves that they could not shoot any better than 186. Once they saw how easy it was they could do it. Mentally they didn’t think it could be done, but once they had observed it, that was that.
What’s your preference in Standard Guns?
The Domino factory, which was the precursor of the FAS, they gave me a gun – it was one of the very first ones ever made back in 1973 – and that’s the same gun I’m using today. I don’t know how many national records I’ve held with that, I know in Great Britain I won four national championships with it.
You might be interested to know the two top Australian shooters still use their old original Dominos, and one shot a national record this year.
What score?
580.
I brought Ragnar Skanaker over in 1981. He arrived in Dallas and I brought the team into San Antonio for a training session. Ragnar was the world champion and world record holder in standard pistol. Eric Buljong took it off him by one point, so he had a, I think, 582. I took him down to San Antonio and there was a match. We put the match on, there was a competition and then there was a training session afterwards, and I shot the match. We shot Standard Pistol. We came off the line and I said to Ragnar, “How did you go?” “Oh, I have won the match.” I said ,”What do you have?” “Five seventy seven.” I said, “Ragnar, I’m very sorry to tell you, I’m currently in third place with a 581 and I think Doc (Young) is going to win it with a 584.” That was the last time Ragnar ever shot Standard Pistol in this country. He could not comprehend. You had to shoot high scores in those days.
Do you think that lower velocity ammunition in Standard is an advantage?
It doesn’t matter. Ten seconds is a hell of a long time. If you start shooting CISM, which is 10, 8 and 6 seconds with a 32. You’re shooting five shots in six seconds from forty five degrees with a 32 – ten seconds in Standard Pistol is a long, long time. I use Eley Tenex. I use the most accurate ammunition I can lay my hands on.
Even though it’s punchy?
Ten seconds is a long time.
What do you use in Center Fire?
A 32 FAS.
Do you use factory (loads) or do you load your own?
No, I’ve got very select lots. I’ve matched lots to the gun. You need it because 32s are inherently not tremendously accurate. The gun I’ve got has a select barrel, in fact we had it specially made up. It puts nice tight groups down there. I was national champion five or six years ago with it and I’ve been number one in CISM four out of five times. But that’s a combination of Center Fire and Military Rapid Fire. Typically Military Rapid is where I make it up.
Have you ever shot Bullseye?
Yes. I wasn’t eligible for the 1976 Olympic Team so they asked me to get distinguished. So I got distinguished in eleven months. I shot Bullseye for a couple of years and then quit. The highest I got in Bullseye was 2643, and I think I shot it two, maybe three years.
Did you use a 32 for Center Fire?
No, a 45-45.
And that was with open sights I take it?
Yes, I used the Domino for the 22 portion and a wad gun Dave Mattice built for me.
What’s the most important advice you could give to a junior just starting out?
You’ve got to get the right equipment. That’s critical. So equipment first, don’t start off with the wrong equipment because that’s going to give you mistakes in your training program. Then develop a diary and work out what to takes to shoot one ten. When you shoot one ten you just repeat it. I mean that’s awfully easy to explain, but if you can set up a plan to shoot one ten and then repeat that through a competition, you’ll win. Right equipment, good grips, then test and make sure your ammo is okay, because if you’re out there trying to shoot tens and the gun is not capable of shooting consistent tens there could be a problem. But once you’ve got your equipment worked out then you need to make sure that you train. And training is very important. In fact that computerized trainer, the RIKA, that’s phenomenal training, because you can actually go through and recall each sequence. So you can tell what you did right and what you did wrong. We never had that, well we did, but only select people had access to the Noptel or the Russian training system, but they were so expensive that it wasn’t readily available. The RIKA, pricewise it’s reasonable, and a coach can stand by you and tell when you’ve done right and done wrong.